can tiles be elevated / lowered?

[Dr.Disaster]

This seems to be an odd question so i try to explain:

Imagine a multi-story level. Those who played and finished Master Quest just need to recall it's amazing four story room at the end.
(oh how i wished i could play that!)

Now imagine you could really play on all of such a level's storys (not just the one you are on) without the need for stairs.

I don't know if that's at all possible with the LoG engine but a way to move up (or down) floors in such multi-story rooms could be elevated tiles (-> Elevator like in DOOM1+2). The party steps on such a tile and is elevated up (or down) to the next floor to continue there.

Possible?

[msyblade]

I think it could be faked with an animation to "appear" as though the walls around the player were moving down (rather than actually moving the party up), and then an invisible, silent teleport to the destination.

[Komag]

That's part of the system devised for Northern Realms project, by Diarmuid IIRC?

[Isaac]

It's technically possible via an odd aspect of the way the engine handles stairs*... but only half a floor level ~up or down. So just [the illusion of] two floors.

To do it without a level load, you'd have to make the upstairs floor ½ a level up and the downstairs ½ a level down (and it can't be wide open rooms; just hallways two cells wide at the max). Good for an effect, but not great for an entire functional level as the monsters could [should] only be Crowerns or Wyverns as none of are unaffected by the change in height like the party is. Uggardians could work I suppose, but they would float midway between both floors ~same as Crowern. Either way the monsters will still look weird without customized animations that reflect what floor they are on, and blockers to prevent any monster from crossing the stairs [up/down] to the other floor. A complex undertaking to be sure; especially if you correct for thrown and dropped items; (which would otherwise float in the air).

* Stepping in the far side of a staircase will raise or lower the player's view by ½ a level's height.

[Dr.Disaster]

I see, so it's not possible for the party to move between storys of a multi-story map by elevation.

EDIT
Never mind

[Isaac]

I see, so it's not possible for the party to move between storys of a multi-story map.

If you mean transitioning between actual levels without a level load ~then no, not as far as I know (or could imagine). Petri said that the stairway events and animation are hard coded in LoG1.

Of what I know [from experience trying it], it is possible to make a seamless passing between two areas on the same level that visually appear to be at different heights; but with restriction on how those areas can be mapped out. And from knowing that, I seems possible that you could make neither floor at the default level [height], but have one ½ up, and the other ½ down... making the two seem to be one floor apart, and allowing the party to visibly travel up or down the steps from from one 'floor' to the other. This method could not make a room that was more than two cells wide, but could make halls as long as one needs them to be.

A ~very~ good effect, just not ideal for large open spaces ~though one could possibly fake the look of that by exploiting strategically placed tables and statues; [that with care could make wider room that was still technically two cells wide for the party to move around in]. This is because the far side of a staircase will lower or raise the view (depending if it's an up or down stair); but the near side (the side we all have seen when using the stairs in the game), the near side will transition the party between floors [level load].

********* To get a better idea of this, start a quick map in the editor make a wide room and place one or more stairs in the center of the room with all cells around them accessible. Then in the preview walk around to the the back side of the steps.

[Diarmuid]

I indeed devised a system to fake multi-level dungeons for LoTNR, and then ported it to the ORRR2, but while working well, it was too intensive performance wise considering the engine limitations.

But with some work, it's possible to fake things quite convincingly. Here's a quick teaser video from the coming ORRR2:



The video quality is not amazing, but you'll have the whole thing in HD for Christmas.

[Isaac]

This we did, and it's a good effect, but he means realtime passage from one floor to the next on a single staircase with no fades. Not possible if the transition is a real one; [shown on the auto-map as different floors]; but possible as a single level visual effect ~within limits ~(and I do it in my ORRR2 room).

[Dr.Disaster]

Almost Isaac, i mean realtime passage without a staircase by lifting (or lowering) the tile the party is currently on.

btw: i'm aware of the fake method; Komag used it (or something very similar) for his Tomb of the Designers in Master Quest.

[Isaac]

Almost Isaac, i mean realtime passage without a staircase by lifting (or lowering) the tile the party is currently on.

Hmmm.... Let me try, I'll tell you in a few minutes.

Yeah, it's possible; I just did it.

Making it look good in the game would require a custom animated elevator model, but the script concept works ~but rather abruptly. The smooth transition I've seen before only happens if the party moves onto the cell; just triggering the effect under them drops them down (or back up) instantly.

Give me a few minutes and I'll package this up as a project with DL link.