Stop import characters

[akroma222]

Yeah I am one of those players who gets super attached to my party lol

The good thing about my self-imposed dilemma is that it has forced me to look at the Grimrock monsters in new and creative ways. As you said, I didn't want to discourage the fun from creating a Mod, so I instead focus on making unique things happen. For example, I built a small Pressure Plate function that, when stepped on, gives players 10 minutes of underwater breathing time, and I also gave a handful of monsters the underwater trait, to help create a slightly new way to experience "dungeon crawling" in the form of ... "water stroking" ??

Hehehe! Here I am trying to tell you what to do lol... You know what youre doing!
The possibilities with underwater 'pressures' are indeed many!

Rrrm seems like the right place to ask... is there a simple way to ensure that an asset pack Class is NOT included in Character Gen screen??

Yes, just don't define it: don't import assets/scripts/char_classes.lua. However starting with a party that uses a nonexistent class (which will include the default party if you exclude fighter, barbarian, alchemist, or wizard) will crash.

But I really dont want the hard coded, food eating, EXP gaining effect of the Farmer around anymore....

This only happens if the character actually has the "farmer" trait, you can just set the class to something else to get rid of it.

Thanks Minmay
After checking I have realised the ony asset pack imports i got are

SpoilerShow

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import "assets/scripts/standard_assets.lua"
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import "assets/scripts/grimrock1/grimrock1_materials.lua"
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Ive checked out your init.lua for the Germanny pack you released ...
Big Thanks!! Great work getting it converted and setting up a test.... mod
You have added asset imports individually though- correct me if Im wrong, have you done this because - import "assets/scripts/standard_assets.lua"
leaves some things out that we have access to,
So import it individually, then leave out the things you dont want from the asset pack?

Sorry just curious, I scoured the whole init.lua - interesting things!

[minmay]

assets/scripts/standard_assets.lua imports all the standard assets. By definition. Open it yourself and take a look. If you don't want all the standard assets (and you don't, since you don't want all the standard classes), you need to leave it out and only import the files with the assets you want.

Artifacts of Might doesn't import standard_assets.lua because that would be a massive waste: there are hundreds of megabytes of models and textures that the dungeon does not use at all, but would be loaded by the standard assets. Instead it imports files that contain the things it does use, and in the cases of files that would load lots of unused assets (such as many of the material files) it defines the needed materials itself instead.

[akroma222]

Gotcha thanks for the explanation hey!

[AndakRainor]

DId you ever consider starting a game(MOD) with your own level up party, that you are near OP? Having resistance fire/ice/etc to 100. SO you do not take any damage at all.

Those things needs to be balanced. Thats why people make a game and later people make a good mod.

I can't let you fight a fire enemy if you inport a party who has level x with fire resist 100. Whats the point then lol. U might as well go afk while that creature attacks you. its 0 dmg.

That is a really good point. I am currently testing a poisoned zone and with 100 resist poison it is nothing more than a beautiful green smoke zone !!!

On the other hand I would like to allow champions import, first because I love my old characters as Azel does . Second because after all, the game is designed that way, it is a feature implemented by Almost Human, I would be a little sad if I had to disable it in any way to keep my mod difficult enough.

So I was wondering if it would be possible to overcome "most" of the issues caused by a high level party... I think monster levels could be used with the right values, which we should discuss, but other parameters should also be adapted. When I read what Minmay says about fighting in Grimrock, it seems like a general criticism and as he said it is totally irrelevant to the leveling or stats system in any way. From his point of view, where damage is totally avoidable, things that could really matter would be perhaps the range of available attacks, or the movement speed, the monsters AI, things like that. In this category, only the range of available attacks depends on the party level, and only if your mod allows to cast all spells without having found any scroll (mine doesn't). Also, an imported party has more chance to have the required skills to use items found immediately.

So as I see it, the number one problem seems to be elemental resistances. I was trying to inflict conditions to champion which would reduce their resistance stats. I tested with

Code: Select all

champion:addStatModifier("resistPoison", -10)

but this stat does not exist. Does any one know the correct syntax to modify resistances in a custom condition ? Or any other idea on how we could avoid dealing 0 elemental damage to high level characters ?

[minmay]

Well you might have noticed that importing a party is not actually allowed in Isle of Nex, only custom dungeons, so the developers clearly don't think the feature is good for every dungeon.

Use "resist_poison" instead of "resistPoison" and it will work.

[Azel]

Well you might have noticed that importing a party is not actually allowed in Isle of Nex, only custom dungeons, so the developers clearly don't think the feature is good for every dungeon.

It seems that trying to use the disabled import feature within the main campaign as a means to assume developer intent can be quite the slippery slope. Afterall, the dev's allow us to turn on the Cheat Console in the main campaign. Does that mean that the developers clearly want everyone to cheat in the Isle of Nex? Probably not

I've always been sad about the lack of Import ability in to the Main Campaign. I think the dev's should allow players to import their party, at the very least, "after" the main campaign has been beaten. MAKE IT HAPPEN

[Isaac]

I love PC import for new adventures, but I consider it a sad cop-out to allow past PCs to be imported into the same map where they gained their experience the first time around.

[Azel]

If you beat the game with your party once, then the goal is accomplished. When the goal is accomplished, there is nothing left to "cop out" from - only enjoying the same thing in new and exciting ways; to suggest otherwise is nonsensical.

There's a YouTube video of someone beating the LoG2 main campaign in 1 hour and 13 minutes; and the party was only Level 6:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSOA2EP3w5I

This only further proves that an imported party wouldn't create any sort of 'cop out' situation since character progression is essentially irrelevant to complete the main campaign. Anything beyond level 6 is unnecessary. But this is all about fun, and there are a plethora of common sense reasons as to why importing a party in to the main campaign can only improve the games replay value and quality of experience.

Plenty of other RPG's, Dungeon Crawlers, and especially Hack n Slash RPG's fully support imported characters. Games like the Diablo series demand it since it is often impossible to fully develop a character by playing through the game only once. In Diablo 1 the player can't even get to half of the max level without repeated play, in Diablo 2 the player cannot fully develop a skill tree without repeated play.

Old school Dungeon Crawlers, like Shadow of Yserbius, allow a new game to take place with an imported character.

In Grimrock, Importing parties allows players to invest in Skill Trees that are otherwise completely ignored, like Earth Magic and Athletics. Personally, that's my favorite part about using my Imported party: giving my Barbarians some much needed Athletics skill, and hitting higher numbers with the Critical skill. Not to mention being able to invest in Missile Weapons so that my party can effectively shoot a bow and arrow as an alternative to their primary high level weapon.

And I prefer to do these things without cheating (eg, using the Console to spawn("tome_wisdom")). I like the RPG aspect of my party going from Mod to Mod (ie, region to region) in order to conquer new quests and get stronger in the process. Standard RPG fun; but If someone actually believes that there is a 'sad cop out' situation occurring with imported parties, then that person has clearly 'copped out' of thinking.

[Isaac]

Well... no, What you get is Veteran PCs that are somehow tracing over their past accomplishments, finding duplicate equipment, and defeating old enemies for double-dip gains. Not cool IMO.

[Azel]

It's not for everyone (although you did just describe every single Hack n Slash RPG on the market), but the point is that while one person may not think it's cool, another may love it due to the replay ability. There's nothing really wrong with playing the same game over and over. Trying to insult people for it seems futile though (eg, accusing someone of being a sad capout for example).

I can see how the Import function can be abused in Grimrock, like restarting the newbie area over and over in order to gain quick levels. Which is why I think at the very least we should only be able to Import if we beat the game once. Afterall, they gave us Toorum Mode right? Is an import party really that much different? Toorum, afterall, already went through the dungeon once (most of it anyway)