Grimrock

After working on a couple of projects for a couple of months with a friend of mine, it seems that the LOG2 editor wants to allow certain modifications to be fairly straight forward, others not so much, and others yet not at all.

One of the limits that we've noticed is the *hard-coding* bits in skills. The Armor skill, for example, has hard-coded components in it that can't be adjusted. We wanted to split it into 2 skills - "light armor" and a "heavy armor" - but that seems to be a lot more challenging than just making a few moves in a .lua file.

Traits seem easy to make, but there are some hard-coded ones there that cannot easily be adjusted and have hard-coded bits too.

Races and Classes can be adjusted, to a point, so we've found. Hard-coded bits here too render a limit on how far this can go.

All in all, it seems like most, or at least a lot, of what goes on at the Character Creation screen, is not to be the focus of most of the modding. Is this true? Or are we just running into barriers that can actually be overcome but that we don't understand?

We're trying to create a game that calls for more modding at the starting screen than anywhere else in the game. Any input on this would be awesome, thank you.

David Ward wrote:After working on a couple of projects for a couple of months with a friend of mine, it seems that the LOG2 editor wants to allow certain modifications to be fairly straight forward, others not so much, and others yet not at all.

One of the limits that we've noticed is the *hard-coding* bits in skills. The Armor skill, for example, has hard-coded components in it that can't be adjusted. We wanted to split it into 2 skills - "light armor" and a "heavy armor" - but that seems to be a lot more challenging than just making a few moves in a .lua file.

Traits seem easy to make, but there are some hard-coded ones there that cannot easily be adjusted and have hard-coded bits too.

Races and Classes can be adjusted, to a point, so we've found. Hard-coded bits here too render a limit on how far this can go.

All in all, it seems like most, or at least a lot, of what goes on at the Character Creation screen, is not to be the focus of most of the modding. Is this true? Or are we just running into barriers that can actually be overcome but that we don't understand?

We're trying to create a game that calls for more modding at the starting screen than anywhere else in the game. Any input on this would be awesome, thank you.

not sure what you want to hear ?
Yes, defined skills are already hardcoded. You can create your own ones. The same stands for traits, races and classes. You can create your own and there are some parms you can modify.
If you want make some "starting" screen inputs, nothing prevents you to do so - however it need to be in the game. So for example when game starts you can start some GUI options ,where player could adjust what you will script.

Can stats (strength, dexterity, vitality, willpower) also be re-created?

If I can pick your brain there Drakkan, how would you go about making a new set of races, classes, skills, and traits, and have the player be able to choose all of these new sets at the party creation screen?

David Ward wrote:Can stats (strength, dexterity, vitality, willpower) also be re-created?

If I can pick your brain there Drakkan, how would you go about making a new set of races, classes, skills, and traits, and have the player be able to choose all of these new sets at the party creation screen?

From what I have seen, you cannot do much with modifying or creating new stats (game calls them attributes). However, you can modify existing or create new, races, classes, skills and traits. To create new, simply add the appropriate asset definition to a LUA file that is referenced in your init.lua. The scripting reference specifies how to define each. Or download the Asset Pack for examples.

You can even modify existing ones, by basically overriding them. When you add a new "define" call to your script, give the same name as an existing entity in the game and you will override it.

So here's the thing. Drakkan, you said, "Yes, defined skills are already hardcoded."

Can these skills with hard-coding bits simply be removed? Can they just *not* be part of the game? Just turn them off, and replace them entirely with new skills?

MrChoke, you said "You can even modify existing ones, by basically overriding them. When you add a new "define" call to your script, give the same name as an existing entity in the game and you will override it."

It seems like overriding has its limits...? Light Weapons has a hard-coded 20% damage boost per skill level. Can this % be changed? Let's say we wanted just a 5% damage boost per skill level. Can we remove the hard-coded 20% boost and replace it with 5%? Or put in a -15% *after* the 20% to reduce it 5%?

David Ward wrote:So here's the thing. Drakkan, you said, "Yes, defined skills are already hardcoded."

Can these skills with hard-coding bits simply be removed? Can they just *not* be part of the game? Just turn them off, and replace them entirely with new skills?

Yes, just don't load assets/scripts/skills.lua or define any skills with the same names as the original ones.

David Ward wrote:MrChoke, you said "You can even modify existing ones, by basically overriding them. When you add a new "define" call to your script, give the same name as an existing entity in the game and you will override it."

It seems like overriding has its limits...? Light Weapons has a hard-coded 20% damage boost per skill level. Can this % be changed? Let's say we wanted just a 5% damage boost per skill level. Can we remove the hard-coded 20% boost and replace it with 5%? Or put in a -15% *after* the 20% to reduce it 5%?

You cannot change the hardcoded effects of skills with certain names ("light_weapons", etc.). But you are not required to define any skills with said names. The console will print a warning if a champion with a non-existent skill is imported but this does not have any other negative effects.

Okay. Just...make a new skill with a new name, and no hard-coded bits come attached, period?

Yes. I believe that the following skills also have no hardcoded effects:
athletics
concentration
accuracy
critical
dodge

and that the following traits have no hardcoded effects:
barbarian
human
minotaur
lizardman
insectoid
ratling
fast_learner
head_hunter
endure_elements
poison_immunity
chitin_armor
quick
athletic
agile
healthy
strong_mind
tough
aura
evasive
fire_resistant
cold_resistant
poison_resistant
natural_armor
endurance
weapon_specialization ("Martial Training")
pack_mule
meditation
staff_defence
uncanny_speed
fire_mastery
air_mastery
earth_mastery
water_mastery

That looks about right, minmay. Most of the skills, then, do have hard-coded stuff.

Here's an example of what we wanted to do. The Armor skill has a hard-coded boost of 5% increased armor protection per skill level. We wanted to eliminate the Armor skill entirely....and create 2 new skills - Light Armor and Heavy Armor.

If we name them like that, "Light Armor" and "Heavy Armor", the 5% hard-coded armor protection boost will not factor into either of those two skills at all? And that we just need to define these two new skills entirely on their own?

The uiName is not important, only the name. As long as you don't set the name field to "armors" it won't get the protection increase.